Female Umpire in Aussie Rules

Speaker 1 0:00

Welcome back Molesy to Head Shepard .

Speaker 2 0:03

Thanks Berg for having me on .

Speaker 1 0:04

Excellent . We're going to change gears a bit this week and not talk too much about farming . Obviously people may know you through your role at RIST as the National Coordinator for Lifetime E-Management and , I'm sure , other things there at RIST . But I guess today we want to talk about when you made headlines last year , I think , as the first female umpire for Aussie rules football in your part of the world . Obviously lots of blokes in that game and when I grew up it was definitely the women played netball and the men played football and that sort of obviously evolved to hate . Maybe we might just before we get into that too much detail . We've got listeners kind of all over the place and so we might just explain what Aussie rules football is to start with .

Speaker 2 0:47

Yeah , it's a bit different from NRL . Good old Aussie football played with an oval-shaped ball , not a round ball on an oval , and your aim is to kick it through the big two sticks at either end of the field for a goal . But yeah , it's totally a different sport , but thoroughly enjoyable and definitely growing in the female community with AWFL and then all the women's teams and leagues around all different districts , your seniors , your juniors , you it's just growing , which is fantastic to see .

Speaker 1 1:18

Yeah , I've got two nieces in Melbourne that used to play it , and certainly one that's still playing it and loving it . So , yeah , it's amazing to see the sport evolve . Yeah , so it is . I guess the difference is play it and certainly one that's still playing it and loving it . So , yeah , no , it's , it's amazing to see the sport evolve . Oh , yeah , so it is . Yeah , I guess the difference is between it and what people might know in europe is maybe football , normal football , which is well , the first football , I guess , was a round ball on a square , square pitch or a rectangle pitch , whereas this is obviously on an oval . Yeah , you got four sticks to kick out . Two will get in the middle , two will get your six points and if you go either side of that you'll get one , and if you miss completely you get zero . Obviously .

Speaker 2 1:46

Absolutely .

Speaker 1 1:47

Massive cardio sport , one of the toughest games I only played as a kid , but certainly in terms of how much running you do , how fit you need to be to play that game as well as and it's quite physical as well , obviously . So it's probably not many sports where you have to travel as far as well as be hit as hard as what you do in Aussie rules .

Speaker 2 2:06

Oh , absolutely . I've got some former bruises from playing it myself . Yeah , you've definitely got to be in good shape well to handle those tackles .

Speaker 1 2:17

Yeah , 100% , so , anyway . So , if we move on , obviously , at some point along your career you've played football , but you were just saying , as we started recording , that you're trying to retire from that and the body's starting to get sick of being beaten up .

Speaker 2 2:29

Absolutely . I was very fortunate . I captained the Hamilton Kangaroos to their premiership side for the senior women's and I've also played for Horsham who this year actually won the premiership as well . So aimably I'd like to retire on a high so that , yeah , no more injuries . But that's why I've actually moved over to umpiring and being a field umpire , because as much as I absolutely love to play the game , it's just hurting too much .

Speaker 2 2:55

So now I'm still on the field running around , but also running around with all the men on the field that you're still part of the game , you don't get tackled . If on the field that you're still part of the game , you don't get tackled . If an umpire gets tackled , there's definitely something wrong . Yeah , but you still feel like you're a part of it , you're not missing out , you're keeping your fitness up and it's such a great skill to be able to do . Undertake is umpiring and being a field umpire . So I was very fortunate . I was the first female field umpire in the Mininera League , which is out here near Hamilton , north of Hamilton or off to the side a bit , and that's been a huge life-changing skill set that you learn and I naturally want to keep growing my own skill set and actually inspire more women to come on out or girls to come on out and start up their umpiring .

Speaker 1 3:43

Yeah , cool , probably , I don't know . I think in most regional sport one of the hardest things to get is good umpires or consistently get umpires like everyone . Obviously there isn't . Yeah , sometimes it can be pretty tough , which we'll get into . I mean , we've heard the normal white maggot chat and all the stuff that people used to get yeah , I guess you don't wear white these days , maybe . But people used to get , yeah , I guess you don't wear white these days maybe . Maybe that helps that . But yeah , obviously you're in the heat of the battle really when you're an umpire of any sport and a lot of people , once they cross that white line , they turn into different humans .

Speaker 2 4:13

Oh , you get white line fever definitely kicks in , absolutely so . You've got like 36 men on a field all with white line fever , so passionate about their football , and you're there to adjudicate it to the best of your ability to be fair and reasonable . And that's one of the best skills that you can learn being an umpire is how to take out your bias and go right . I've got to call it , see it , protect the head , protect the players and try and have that communication skills . That's probably one thing I've really taken away from being an umpire is your ability to communicate and your voice is such a powerful tool to use um and how to de-escalate situations , how to listen , how to calm down . You don't want to be reaching for your yellow or red cards and pull them out of your sock to send someone off . You want to try and keep it enjoyable and fair for the whole , for both teams yeah , excellent , I mean we're .

Speaker 1 5:01

We're far from a sports podcast , but that's not going to stop us today . But I reckon some of the best refs umpires , you see are the ones that are communicating all the time . You can just hear them continually talking to the players and letting them know that that's not on or is on or whatever , which everyone responds to , I think , when they kind of know they're not going to get away with too much , but also they've given them enough leniency to keep the game moving .

Speaker 2 5:24

Oh , absolutely , and that's probably one thing you can learn , like being an umpire is .

Speaker 1 5:38

you can also then take that skill set outside , into your work , into life , in understanding that I'm on one side of the play , trying to understand what I'm seeing and you'll hear the crowd on the other side of the play going oh what happened there , ref ?

Speaker 2 5:43

And you're like , okay , there's two sides here . I've got to get around the contest , see what's actually happening to try and make that correct call . But also you can associate that back in life going . If you've got a situation where somebody's doing something you can't , you've got to move your perception and your thoughts around to be able to try and understand what they're seeing , what you're seeing , and make an informed decision . And that's been like a big sort .

Speaker 1 6:08

Yeah , for sure I've heard . One of the better things I heard the other day on the sideline was take off your eye patch and see both sides . There'll be a fair few one-eyed supporters out there and one-eyed players , no doubt , and everyone thinks I mean . Half the time my boys walk off a game they think the ref's been unfair , which clearly they weren't . But anyway , I guess being a woman out with 36 emotionally charged blokes , I mean does that get . I'm kind of thinking that would de-escalate things rather than escalate things when compared to a male of similar age and similar whatever that they would normally encounter .

Speaker 2 6:42

Yeah , it was definitely a sort of a different attitude that you have . Like the guys were , I think , like really respectful and I think in ways they've sort of had to go oh , she's female , okay , better behave . I had one instance when I was like my first or second game , I wasn't getting my ball ups , weren't high enough in the air , and I had one of the players or the captain , come up to me and goes oh , we don't want to criticise , but can you get your ball up just a bit higher ? And I'm like , yeah , no worries , mate , okay , I'll do that . So I called my next ball up and really you know lifted it up , heaved it up and yep , ran past the captain onto my next contest .

Speaker 2 7:20

I said , how was that ? He said yeah , oh great , keep going , keep going . And I'm like fantastic , and it's that communication and that you're actually not there to be evil . You're wanting to enjoy it as much as they do . So talk to us . We're happy to explain the rules or , if you want something adjusted like the ball up , happy to do that . That's probably why I enjoy it . You feel like you're a part of the game .

Speaker 1 7:44

Yeah , Now , you've already mentioned personal growth , but I guess is there much ? Have you gone through training to do that sort of stuff , or has it just been ? You know the game and here's the whistle and hook into it ?

Speaker 2 7:54

I suppose I was a bit fortunate playing the game , that you already had a basic understanding of the rules . But then I naturally inquired through the AFL website and they put me in contact with the club local to Hamilton Vampires and I got the president . He took me out to the first game , ran with me right beside me and then just attended trainings and information sessions and just kept growing my knowledge and skills . But the best learning I've learned has been out in the field , having coaches come out afterwards and say right , you did well , you've got to stop doing this or adjust this or come around this way and run a bit your different diagonals to keep learning . And yeah , hands-on learning is by far the best way to do it .

Speaker 1 8:38

Yeah , I guess hands-on learning . But yeah , often you want to do hands-on learning without being watched , but obviously there's a few people around the sidelines watching

Umpiring Challenges and Life Resilience

Speaker 1 8:47

it . Those early games must have been a little bit nerve-wracking , despite any preparation .

Speaker 2 8:51

Oh , 100% , 100% , 100% . You're walking out there and you're like this is a very male-dominated sport . Here . I am the only female in the middle here . Wow , I suppose I put extra pressure on myself to try and do a really good job to justify while I'm out there , but the compliments have been coming through , the support's been coming through immensely and I'd love to see more females out there coming on board , especially in the farming and the rural communities . There is opportunities there to support your local clubs and , whether it's boundary field goal umpirings , it's great to just get out there and help your local club .

Speaker 1 9:28

How many ? What do you do in terms of your tractor Ks ? How many ? What do you run in a normal game ?

Speaker 2 9:34

Different games , different scenarios , but yeah , anywhere between 12 to 14 Ks on a good senior men's game . In a two umpires situation . You're running back and forth that field . Yeah , definitely . Especially in the seniors . We're fully timed games . We are definitely locking them up .

Speaker 1 9:50

Yeah , yeah , no , it's a fair bit of ground to cover up and down , because obviously they can kick 60 meters . You've got a , well , obviously two umpires , but you don't have to . Yeah , but you can , they move .

Speaker 2 9:59

That ball moves around pretty quick oh yeah , and you and you just run smarter , not harder . You just run out on the angle and then get in a better position to looking on the side , but naturally fatigue kicks in and you are trying to still make you know , a judgment call while on the run and then keep pushing again down to the next position . So , and that's in life , you get fatigued .

Speaker 1 10:18

You've got to learn how to still make decisions , and that's part and parcel of it yeah , and the beauty about that fatigue is , as you get tired of the , the stakes get higher . Really , as you get closer to the final whistle , everything , the emotion starts getting higher .

Speaker 2 10:31

Oh yeah , especially finals games or games where they're , you know , the top two sides or middle sides . It's a very even game . Stakes get higher , intensity gets higher and you can get a little bit of that backlash a little bit as well . But like anything , you learn to build resilience from it , and that's one thing I've enjoyed . Learning is that when the players are out there they are if they do get a bit , you know , lippy or something like that , most of the time they're actually frustrated themselves . They've missed the mark , they haven't handballed it , the kick went off to the shank to the left .

Speaker 1 11:03

Yeah , yeah .

Speaker 2 11:05

It's not at you at all , you just whatever that's about keep moving and just control the game . So that's been another great skill to learn .

Speaker 1 11:14

Yeah , cool , I'm thinking you played footy with probably hundreds of women , with and against hundreds of women , and only not many of you decided to go umpire . Are you normally someone that sort of likes to jump out of your comfort zone , or is this a bit of a step up for you ? Or is it something you normally try and challenge yourself ?

Speaker 2 11:29

I definitely like to challenge myself . This is definitely outside my comfort zone , but I suppose it's something I enjoy keep fit and probably trying to inspire more people to do something that they haven't thought of . So you know , that's probably why I try and get around different clubs . I'm hiring with women's , men's , the junior kids so that parents can see well if she's doing it , others can jump on board and have a go as well . See well if she's doing it , others can jump on board and have a go as well . So there's a heap of opportunities out there . But definitely my personality type is to have a go at something that may not be happening very often .

Speaker 1 12:01

Yeah , no , definitely , and you mentioned sort of stuff that I guess what you learn on the field and where you take that in terms of yeah , I mean resilience . I mean it's pretty hard to self-assess I suppose , but have you noticed any changes from sort of life pre-ampiring to now ?

Speaker 2 12:16

Definitely , like in your day-to-day life , you'll find people that get frustrated at you . Like work , life outside of working , in just general conversations , people might get frustrated with a decision or a direction you're going with and that just comes back to communication , resilience and understanding that they could be having a bad day or something hasn't gone right . They've interpreted something differently to the way you've explained it and that I think in itself has helped people a lot in building that skill set to take a step back and not be emotional about the situation , because I can honestly say there's been times I've come off that field and I have been exhausted and , you know , felt the pressure of acquiring such a challenging game and you do have to try and step up and rise above it and keep pushing through it and after , when you finish it , you're like , wow , I did that . I can't believe I got through that

Community Umpiring and Inspiration

Speaker 2 13:07

.

Speaker 1 13:07

And same in life you can apply that exact same skill set again out here yeah , and yeah , one thing I struggle with or have struggled with , or maybe still do , don't know , but the is like , I guess , when you know , like having a science brain like mine , you kind of have this perception that what you have , you have the theory that there's there is one source of truth , whereas there actually isn't , because truth is just what people perceive it as , and and while I guess newton's theory is truth , but then for there's lots of other bits of , particularly in livestock and farming , I suppose there's not everything works everywhere and there's different , different theories and stuff that we have to encounter .

Speaker 1 13:43

And it is quite frustrating when , when you think you know the truth , but someone else is saying , looking at exactly the same situation as coming up with a different truth , and that's kind of that's umpiring , but that's life as well . Like you only see what you see and you get to make your call , but someone else has a different perspective , different confirmation bias , different whatever will have a different interpretation based on , yeah , what they want to believe half the time or whatever . So , yeah , it is . I'm sure there's great life skills in having to live in that world where you have to stick and you have to back your judgment . And you see , one thing I hate I suppose I hate the strong word but when you're on the sideline and you've got kids trying umpiring like early on and you've got some stupid parent yelling at them and you know that it's like they're trying to do the , it's a pretty tough gig out there in the first place . And then , yeah , it's pretty horrible when you see it around the trap .

Speaker 2 14:28

So it's good to . It's not just in football , it's in all sports as well , and that's where we just ask for people to be a little bit more , to have that respect towards us . We're still learning . Our interpretation is going to be different to what they see , and that's that whole their view on a situation , whereas then the other umpire can be completely blindsided by another player that's just gone straight in front of their vision and could not see exactly what you just saw .

Speaker 2 14:52

It's having that ability to shift perspectives and be encouraging and realising that . But naturally , like anything , you want to protect the players , especially with the heads , with the concussions , and being mindful of ensuring that they are not getting any intentional or dirty play , as I call it . It's got to be fair and reasonable and just being on the ball to watch it all .

Speaker 1 15:14

Yeah , yeah . What's the ultimate aim on every young AFL footballer's sort of dreams of running onto the MCG at grand final day ? What's the top end of where you'd like to see this part of your career go ?

Speaker 2 15:27

I would like to try and get up into the highest level of football umpiring in our region , which is probably the Hampton League . So I really want to build my skills and my fitness and run in that league eventually and try and inspire more to do the same . And I'd love to take some younger females under my wing in some junior games and get them umpiring in a field position so that they enjoy it and know that there's a female there to support them through that journey as well , but definitely in the Hampton , and look for that long-term opportunity in finals . Don't think VFL or AFLW is quite on the cards for me , but how nice would it be if someone in our region took it up and they went on to their dream and I could have helped and inspired to go that way .

Speaker 1 16:12

Yeah , yeah , cool . Yeah , yeah . No , we can't all play now . I'm sure that's what I wanted to do when I was five , but didn't get anywhere Not even in the same state , really . But anyway , it's all good , yeah , but yeah , it's awesome to see that people out there challenging themselves and , yeah , inspiring young people to do do great things to keep our regions firing and and lively and happy . It's , um , obviously you're , you're there in southwest victoria probably one of the toughest periods , uh , that the region's seen in terms of weather and stuff . So it's a it's an important year to have resilience building going on oh , absolutely , and I think that's you know .

Speaker 2 16:48

Football plays such a huge part in our communities in bringing people together where other people are all challenged from different angles , and having that communication , networking ability and footy brings that over that period . And then we're going to cricket as well over the summer . But yeah , naturally we're always looking for more officials in all forms of sports . So there is some really great benefits to learn for being official in your sport that you love and contributing to your own community and helping grow that and foster future generations as well .

Speaker 1 17:19

Perfectly , perfectly said . And yeah , obviously the lifeblood of rural communities is country sport and yeah , I don't know the untold who knows how many mental health situations have been saved by rocking up on a Saturday morning and supporting your team or whatever , and whether it's netball or footy or cricket in the summer , yeah , obviously a massive part of community . And getting people off farm , which is critical to most . You're kind of completely enclosed in life and getting off farm for that bit of a relief and seeing , seeing a few mate maybe yelling at an umpire or two , but then yep , I always say .

Speaker 2 17:58

Actually what I realize , if I think I've done a good job , is when the losing team will come up to you and actually shake your hand and say thank you , well done for umpiring , because that there tells you that you've actually done a fair job .

Speaker 2 18:08

Because even though they've lost , it's not you that they're blaming it on or taking it on , they're actually looking at their own sort of self-awareness or skill set there . That's when I probably have the most value out of the game and , yeah , getting off the field . I haven't ever been in a situation where someone's come up and said anything mean if anything . I've actually had a lot of community support being out there and people just yeah , thank , thank you and well done and um , great job and great to see a female out there .

Speaker 1 18:36

So cool I'd love to see more yeah , I guess most people once the once , the once the back over the other side of the white line . Everyone comes down again and and turn back into humans again , which which is always good . Yeah , we were talking just before coming online and you said you'd got an award as well . Bec , tell us a little bit about that .

Speaker 2 18:55

Thank you . Yes , I have just actually received the AFL Victoria's Umpiring Service Award . So I was nominated by some local clubs around this region for the inspiration they've seen in me being a female umpire out here and trying to inspire and grow more opportunities for women and girls to join into umpiring . I've got an idea and I put it to Hampton that I'm aware of that we try and get like an all-female team umpiring a game and it actually worked out that we had nearly all women and girls in the under-18 youth girls grand final , so myself was included and we only had one male umpire . The rest were all females and I was absolutely ecstatic to see that actually progress to that level . So that's one of my . I've been very lucky to receive that award and very honoured as well .

Speaker 1 19:51

Awesome , congratulations . One of the questions we always ask guests , which I didn't give you any warning on this , so you can take as long as you need , but the what is the last thing you changed your mind about ?

Speaker 2 20:02

Last thing I changed my mind about .

Speaker 1 20:04

Yeah , yeah .

Speaker 2 20:05

As in out there in the umpire world or just in general . Anything , yeah , yeah , as in out there in the umpiring world or just in general anything . Oh yeah , you didn't give me framework on that one no um last thing I changed my mind it's a tough question .

Speaker 1 20:17

It is a tough one yeah it's actually .

Speaker 2 20:21

I was actually umpiring on sunday and this is where I had to adjust myself , because I went from like a senior men's games that I've been doing over the winter and now the women's side is kicked up over in the limestone coast and I did a game on Sunday and naturally each league has slightly variations in how you umpire . So most of when I'm doing the men's , I say stand on the mark , which is what they must stand , otherwise if they step forward you can take a 50-metre penalty , whereas in the women's in the limestone they're actually like move on the mark , um sideways , they just can't step over it . So naturally I had to adjust and change my mind on a decision there and gone . Oh , I'm sorry , that's my bad . Uh , you're allowed to move , just don't step over the line or step over the mark there and um , not penal them . So that's something . Yeah , you had to quickly adjust to . Yeah , I'm not sure what else changed my mind . No , yeah , I'm very decisive , I think actually .

Speaker 1 21:19

Yeah , it's a tough question and that's why we ask it to make people think a bit differently . Yeah , sometimes it extracts different answers out of different people . So , particularly if we've been talking something sciencey the whole time , it's sort of nice to get cut to someone's personality a bit with that question . So that's why it's asked . But yeah , I reckon it's going to be interesting to see how women's footy continues to evolve . I mean , it's certainly I don't know how old is how long , since it was sort of how long 10 years more . How old is how long , since it was sort of how long 10 years more , 15 years , I don't know Since it really sort of started to take off .

Speaker 2 21:52

Good question . I actually haven't looked up the stats of when AFLW kicked off . I think maybe in coincide with the same time that NRL Women's was also going ahead as well .

Speaker 2 22:03

I think they're about the same era , but it's definitely grown . We've now seen all AFL teams have all got an AFLW women's team in the league and that's grown over time , like , definitely grown very rapidly and like in this region the under-15s there's more teams coming into our Western Victorian Female Football League , which is brilliant to see young ones also taking up the football and hopefully they will be the next generation coming through . So it's definitely growing and hopefully will keep growing as well . So now it's the umpire's side to go with that side and bring more women into umpiring .

Passion for Australian Rules Football

Speaker 1 22:41

Yeah , and I think , just for those listeners who have never lived in southern Australia , like it's the fury or the passion around AFL , which is australian rules football league is australian football league . But yeah , australian rules football is insane . Like you'll get . It's kind of what , I guess baseball is to a us country town and what , what ice hockey is toa canadian town , like it's . It's absolutely the life , like it's massive , um , I think people when obviously it's only played in southern australia and and so a lot of people around the world wouldn't know it , but there's as much passion and as much focus as any sport you'll ever see . Anyway , 100% , with sort of 50,000 , 60,000 people turning up to a weekend game just to back their clubs .

Speaker 2 23:23

Absolutely . We just had Katy Perry at our AFL grand final , so yeah , it's definitely our nation's largest sport .

Speaker 1 23:30

Yeah yeah , I mean we're trying to watch any sport .

Speaker 2 23:35

I'm a bit biased , I should say , because the NRL will definitely probably disagree with me on that . But for us down here , we love our footy .

Speaker 1 23:43

Yeah , yeah , 100% Awesome , bec . Well , we'll leave you back to do some work , but thanks very much for coming on . Thanks for inspiring some young women out there , hopefully , and it's awesome to see people getting out of their comfort zone , doing things that aren't what everyone else is doing , and keeping rural sport ticking over at the same time .

Speaker 2 24:03

Well , thank you so much for having me on Berg , Much appreciated .

Speaker 1 24:06

Excellent , thank you .